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segunda-feira, 31 de maio de 2010

Srila Prabhuada on India's Wealth

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Amrita Gopala Dasi:

April 15, 1977

Prabhupada: Srimad-bhagavatam amalam puranam. This is the regrettable fact,
that we have got in India the real knowledge.

Mr. Rajda: Real...?

Prabhupada: Real knowledge. And we have locked up that knowledge.

Mr. Rajda: We have locked up. That is the greatest crime we have committed.

Indian (1): We have not allowed it to grow all over the world.

Prabhupada: Jnana-khala. Sarasvati jnana-khale yatha sati. There is a verse
like this in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. Jnana-khale. If you have got some
knowledge, you should distribute it. That will glorify you, not that "I have
got some knowledge. I'll keep it secret." So India has got such exalted vast
knowledge of spiritual life, and that is locked up. We are imitating the
Western dog-dancing. This I wanted to bring to your notice. This will not do
any good. So some arrangement should be made that this exalted knowledge of
India must be distributed. That I have begun with my humble...

Mr. Rajda: No, that is very nicely done.

Prabhupada: But I have no co-operation of the authorities. That is most
regrettable. So now there is change of government.

Mr. Rajda: Yes.

Prabhupada: And Morarji is very religious person.

Mr. Rajda: Yes, he is a highly religious man.

Prabhupada: So why not attempt? At least keep an ideal institution. Just like
for technical knowledge, if there is a good medical college any part of the
world, people go there without any consideration of nationality or anything.
Similarly let there be an ideal institution in India so that the whole world
will come in there.

Mr. Rajda: We had those universities, Taka(?), Silandar(?), and Narandhara...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: ...in ancient days.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: And people from all over the world were coming.

Prabhupada: So why don't you invite now?

Mr. Rajda: Quite.

Prabhupada: We go there for imitating their technology. But who comes here to
learn something?

Mr. Rajda: Quite right, quite right.

Prabhupada: But we have got. The example is already set up. These boys, they
have not come here for learning your cycle manufacturing. They have enough of

Mr. Rajda: That matter of cycle he is doing.

Prabhupada: And we are proud of manufacturing cycle and sewing machine. So that
is my request, that I have started it. Make it an organized institution that
the people from all parts of the world...

Mr. Rajda: Would come over here.

Prabhupada: ...would come here and learn this knowledge. This is Caitanya
Mahaprabhu's mission. Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission is...

Mr. Rajda: Gaudiya mission.

Prabhupada: Not Gaudiya mission. Caitanya's mission, Lord Caitanya. You know
Lord Caitanya.

Mr. Rajda: Yes, yes, yes, Caitanya Mahaprabhu.

Prabhupada: So He declares that bharata-bhumite manusya-janma haila yara: [Cc.
Adi 9.41] "Anyone who has taken birth as human being, not cats and dogs..."
Cats and dogs, they simply jump whole night: "Gow! Gow! Gow!" That is
another... We find so many dogs, whole night busy, watching. Whose property he
is watching? But he... He has got this business, very busy. As soon as some
motorcycle or some..., "Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow!" watching, watching,
watching. So therefore this is business of cats and dogs. But human being's
business is different. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, bharata-bhumite
haila manusya-janma yara: [Cc. Adi 9.41] "Anyone who has taken birth as a human
being in India, bharata-bhumi..." Janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara:
"First of all make your life perfect" -- you have got the opportunity, Vedic
culture -- "and then distribute the knowledge all over the world for doing good
to the whole human society." That will glorify the prestige of India. So why
not continue this? Let there be an institution fully following the principles
of Bhagavad-gita, Bhagavad-gita As It Is. Then people will be benefited. If you
say, "It is secular," Bhagavad-gita is for every man. There is no question of
Hindu, Muslim, Christian or this or that, no. When Krsna says,

dehino 'smin yatha dehe

kaumaram yauvanam jara

tatha dehantara-praptir

dhiras tatra na muhyati

[Bg. 2.13]

So this growing... A child is growing to become a boy. A boy is growing to
become a young man. A young man is growing to become an old man. So what is the
secular? Everyone grows. Does it mean, when it is spoken in the Bhagavad-gita,
it is only meant for the Hindus?

Mr. Rajda: It is universal activities.

Prabhupada: It is universal, science. It is science. So why this science is
kept locket up and distorted by the leaders? If you understand one line of
Bhagavad-gita, your life becomes successful. Now our leaders are supposed to
read Bhagavad-gita, but who understands this one line, tatha dehantara-praptir
dhiras tatra na muhyati [Bg. 2.13]? Nobody understands. And they are scholars
of Bhagavad-gita. They cannot understand this one line in the beginning. This
is going on. So I would request you to take this matter seriously and... And it
is being responded. I am writing these books on Bhagavad-gita,
Srimad-Bhagavatam, and we are selling daily five to six lakhs' worth of books.
In a foreign country, where their religious system is different, and during
Christmas festival we are selling our books, large quantity.

Mr. Rajda: That's a novel thing, no, novel thing.

Prabhupada: So unless there is something substantial... They are intelligent.

Mr. Rajda: Intelligent people.

Prabhupada: Why they should accept this? And this is one man's attempt.

Mr. Rajda: It has got to be institutionalized.

Prabhupada: Yes. Why not make that? This political change, this political
situation change, it will go on. Today you are powerful. Tomorrow I am
powerful. That does not make any difference. Indira Gandhi was so powerful. In
one day everything finished. So it may be finished, my position. Mohitam
nabhijanati mam ebhyah param avyayam [Bg. 7.13]. Tribhir gunamayair bhavaih.
They do not know, behind these all activities there is a person who can do
anything He likes. So what about to know about Him? So these things are there
in India. The knowledge is not secret. It is open. So without distorting it,
without breaking it and spoiling it, why not give it as it is for the benefit
of the whole humanity? You are young man. You can think over.

Indian (1): With a commission.

Prabhupada: But...

Mr. Rajda: With your blessings... With your blessing I can be sure to be able
to do something.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: Last time we had talked about this, and in Delhi, actually, I was on
the verge of arranging the meeting, but never here. But then our Giriraja
telephoned me, and in deference to your health we didn't arrange that meeting
in Delhi. When Morarji-bhai is coming here, we shall see that...

Prabhupada: Yes. First of all you can talk. It is not expected that everyone
will be able to understand. It is not expected.

manusyanam sahasresu

kascid yatati siddhaye

yatatam api siddhanam

kascin mam vetti tattvatah

[Bg. 7.3]

It is not easy job. But still, some ideal institution should be there who are
actually serious to understand. They may be given the chance. That must be
there. In the university, when we were students, there were some postgraduate
classes that no student was coming. But still, the university maintained that
class, paying, in those days, 1,200, 1,500, salaries to the professors. They
maintained that. So here there is no question of salary. Here the institution
must be maintained, strictly following the principles of Bhagavad-gita. It is
open. It is not difficult at all. Just like Krsna says the perfect life, how
one can become perfect, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru: [Bg.
18.65] "Always think of Me," man-manah, "just become My devotee," mad-bhaktah,
"worship me," mad-yaji mam namaskuru, "simply offer your obeisances unto Me."
One, two, three, four-four items. If you do one item at least, your life
becomes successful. Even this child can do this. So to understand Bhagavad-gita
and follow the principle -- not at all difficult. It is not reserved for any
particular class of men or country or society, such a nice thing, and the human
body is meant for understanding this knowledge, not to imitate the cats and
dogs, jumping. This is being done by the cats and dogs. By evolutionary
process, when we come to the human form of life, it is meant for understanding
this science. So this opportunity there is, but we are blocking them not to
take this knowledge and try to understand how to jump like cats and dogs.
Greatest disservice to the human society. We have got such chance, so instead
of helping you to get the chance, if I mislead you another way, is it not
greatest disservice?

Mr. Rajda: Yes.

Prabhupada: That is being done all over the world. If you simply understand
this one line, tatha dehantara-praptih... [Bg. 2.13]. So today I am Indian, and
after death I become something else. There are 8,400,000 different bodies.
Today I may be very exalted minister, and tomorrow, if I become something
else... I'll have to, because nature's law, you cannot check. Tatha dehant...
Just like here is child. You cannot check to become young man. That is not in
your power. She must become or he must become. Similarly, tatha
dehantara-praptih, it is not in your hand or in my hand. It is in the hand of
the prakrti. Prakrteh kriyamanani gunaih karmani sarvasah, ahankara-vimudhatma
[Bg. 3.27]. So there are so many things that... The human society requires this
knowledge and we are trying to give this knowledge alone with our humble
attempt, and these foreigners are helping with their pranair arthair dhiya
vaca, by their life, by their money, by their intelligence, by their words.
(aside:) Give them pad. They cannot sit comfortably. There is pad. Give him.
Pads. Yes. No, no. Oh. (Hindi) Sukham asinah.(?) First of all one must... Give
her. So we have got, at least in Bombay, the most important place in India,
this institution. So come here. Try to understand the philosophy. There is no
difficulty. But we neglect it. We are simply ne..., and distorting. Everyone is
giving his own interpretation. Eh? Then when, where is the importance of Krsna?
If Bhagavad-gita is a book who is authority, and if you interpret and give your
own interpretation, then where is the authority? Suppose Parliament passes one
law, and if I interpret in my own way, then where is the authority of the law?
This is the idea. If you want to give some idea of your own, give it
separately. Why do you take Bhagavad-gita and distort it? This is not
gentlemanly, this. We are presenting, therefore, Bhagavad-gita as it is, and it
is being accepted. And before me so many swamis, yogis went there. They also
tried to explain Bhagavad-gita, but nobody accepted. There was... In the
history there was not a single devotee of Krsna before my going. Now there are
thousands. Why? The secret is that I am presenting as it is.

Mr. Rajda: As it is, quite.

Prabhupada: No distortion, no cheating. This is the secret. They give me
credit, "Swamiji, you have done wonderful. You have done..." I say the secret
of wonderful is this, that I have not distorted it. I have presented
Bhagavad-gita as it is. It is open secret.

Mr. Rajda: That creates... It has created... Your attempts have created a good
impact on the Western world.

Prabhupada: Everyone is doing(?). But we have rejected. Our misfortune is that
our property, we have rejected.

Mr. Rajda: Instead of rejecting, it would be correct to say that we have locked
it up.

Prabhupada: That means we don't take any importance. But now, if you want to do
something, then you maintain this institution rigidly, follow the principles of
Bhagavad-gita. It doesn't matter. It doesn't require many men. Ekas candras
tamo hanti na ca tara sahasrasah. If there is one moon in the sky, that is
sufficient. You don't require millions of stars, twinkling. So let there be an
institution, and it is open to everyone. There is no question of "secular" and
particular.... Let them learn this art. That is wanted. Not blindly, but apply
your consideration and take it after mature judgment. No, what is that?
Everything is there. There is no difficulty. Why you are neglecting this
important business of India? Do you think it is right?

Mr. Rajda: One should not neglect. And as real it is done, it is better, not
only for the world, for India also.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: Rejected... The impediment was that all those rulers, most of them
gave up believing in religion.

Prabhupada: Why you are bringing religion? It is science. Why you are mistaking
again? Is that religion, a child is growing to become a young man? Is that
religion? It is science.

Mr. Rajda: But they do not look at from that perspective.

Prabhupada: That means rascals. They do not accept "Two plus two equal to

Mr. Rajda: Yeah, correct. Intelligent...

Prabhupada: If we do not take mathematics as it is, and if we interpret "Two
plus two equal to three," that is rascaldom. "Two plus two equal to four," that
is everywhere.

Mr. Rajda: Quite right. Everything is right. Now only put some concrete
proposals, how do we want to proceed in this...

Prabhupada: The proposal is there. Here it is already done. The same principle,
the four things, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru, mam
evaisyasi asamsayah [Bg. 18.65]. These four principles, what is the difficulty?
But if you are determined, "No, we shall not follow," then who can educate you?
There is no loss. And if there is some gain, why not take it? We have to
educate so many young men. So I think that harijana movement... You can bring
that... That one gentleman, Dr. Parmar(?), you know him?

Mr. Rajda: Dr. Faramar?

Prabhupada: Yes?

Mr. Rajda: Faramar, I have... Yeah.

Prabhupada: He has regretted that "Government has spent so much money and we
have tried, but we could not improve our position."

Tamala Krsna: This gentleman that Srila Prabhupada was mentioning is named
Professor Parmar. He's written one article.

Prabhupada: Profess... Professor.

Mr. Rajda: Professor Parmar. Ah, ha, that is...

Prabhupada: He is the same man?

Mr. Rajda: No, that's a different.

Prabhupada: So they are hankering after for improving. Everyone is hankering.
So let there be a demi-official, a regular institute to teach people the
principles of Bhagavad-gita as it is. Bas. Don't distort it. Don't amend it. As
it is. What is the objection?

Mr. Rajda: I can't find any objection.

Prabhupada: Bhagavad-gita is accepted, and so far I understand that when
Morarji was going to be arrested, he said that "Let me finish my reading of
Bhagavad-gita." I read it in the paper.

Mr. Rajda: Yes, he was saying.

Prabhupada: So he... He's a devotee of Bhagavad-gita, and there are many
others. So why this teaching should not be given to the whole world?

Mr. Rajda: Now, sir, daily he gets up at 3.30 a.m., does first of all his
religious things, reading of Bhagavad-gita and all this. And that goes on for
two, three hours. Then, at seven, he comes out of his room after taking his
bath. Then he meets particular...

Prabhupada: And these foreign boys, they begin their, this Bhagavad-gita
practice from 3.30 to 9.30. They have no other business. You see. You have
studied our, this Giriraja. The whole day he's doing. They're all on this. From
morning, 3.30, till they are tired, 9.30, simply Bhagavad-gita.

Mr. Rajda: Wonderful.

Prabhupada: And we have got so many materials. If we discuss on this one line,
tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13], it takes days to understand.

Mr. Rajda: Quite.

Prabhupada: Now, if this is fact, tatha dehantara-praptih and na hanyate
hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20], what we are doing for that? This is Bhagavad-gita.
Na jayate na mriyate va kadacin na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. So when
my body is destroyed, I am going... [break] ...from door to door, selling the
books and sending money. We are pushing on our mission in the way. I am not
getting any help neither from the government, from the public. And the record
is there in the Bank of America, how much foreign exchange I am bringing. Even
in this feeble health also, I am working four hours at least, at night. And
they are also helping me. So this is our individual attempt. Why not come here?
If you are actually very serious student of Bhagavad-gita, why don't you come,
cooperate? And harav abhaktasya kuto mahad-guna manorathenasati dhavato... [SB
5.18.12]. You cannot make public honest simply by legislation. That is not
possible. Forget it. That is not possible. Harav abhaktasya kuto.... Yasyasti
bhaktir bhagavaty akincana sarvaih... If you, if one becomes devotee of the
Lord, all good qualities will be there. And harav abhaktasya kuto mahad... If
he's not a devotee... Now so many things, condemnation, is going on, big, big
leaders. Today's paper I have seen. "This man, that man, is rejected even."
Why? Harav abhaktasya kuto. What is the benefit of becoming a big leader if
he's not a devotee? (Hindi) You are very intelligent, young, and therefore I am
trying to give you some idea, and if you can give some shape to these ideas...
It is already there. It is no secret. Simply we must be serious, that this
institution must be there for educating the whole human society. Never mind, a
very small number. It doesn't matter. But ideal must be there.

Mr. Rajda: That is right, correct. If it is possible at all...

Giriraja: No, no difficulty. No, no, no. No difficulty.

Prabhupada: And we are prepared to challenge or meet challenge of any
scientist, any philosopher, any politician, anyone. It is not dogmatic.

Mr. Rajda: Not dogmatic at all.

Prabhupada: The same: it is science. And Krsna says, begins, tatha
dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13], kaumaram yauvanam jara. So who can say anything
against this statement? Avajananti mam mudhah [Bg. 9.11]. But unfortunately our
people takes Krsna as ordinary human being, as... Avajananti mam mudhah. If we
remain mudha, how we can be...? Because Krsna comes just like a human being to
teach us, we are taking that He's one of us. "Then I can also become Krsna."
This is going on. For so many thousands of years Krsna is being worshiped as
the Supreme Personality of Godhead. There are millions of temples in India for
worshiping Krsna. He is ordinary man? So many big, big leaders came and gone.
Who care for them? Why Krsna is being worshiped still? These are the questions.

Indian (1): It is universal message.

Prabhupada: Now universal. Yes, we have got recent pictures from our different
temples. Just see how they are being worshiped. This is in foreign countries.
They have got their own religion. Why they should worship Krsna? (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: Yeah, the entire get up is really perfect.

Prabhupada: (Hindi) Prasada? (pause) What is the circulation of our this

Tamala Krsna: Of our magazine?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: One million copies per month.

Mr. Rajda: One million copies.

Tamala Krsna: That's in English only. Then it also is published in Spanish and
Portuguese, German, French, Dutch, Japanese, Chinese, Hindi, Bengali...

Prabhupada: Gujarati.

Tamala Krsna: Gujarati, Telegu. Recently we came out with Hungarian
publication. (pause)

Indian (1): Swamiji, your idea is to have some international institution.

Prabhupada: Yes, this is international.

Indian (1): No, we must made to speak your needs of the mankind...

Prabhupada: Yes, they are following. They are following. I want to make it more
speedy, but I have no help. Now, for the time being... Now these boys are
helping me, and government is driving them away: "Get out! Get out!" Can you
not help me in this?

Mr. Rajda: Correct. Actually ...

Prabhupada: No Indians are coming. I am bringing men and money from there, and
government is driving them: "Get out!" This is my position. And if one boy goes
back and again comes -- ten thousand rupees. In this way I am losing five to
six lakhs of rupees per year -- for nothing. This is the co-operation of the

Mr. Rajda: But why the government is driving them out?

Prabhupada: This, your so-called visa.

Tamala Krsna: They won't give us the proper visas so we can stay.

Prabhupada: Just like I have got in America permanent residence. So why not
give them permanent resident?

Mr. Rajda: Correct. But this problem could be settled very easily.

Prabhupada: Kindly do that. At least...

Mr. Rajda: No, I didn't know. Just now I came to know. This... I can touch

Indian (1): That's why we want some concrete things from you.

Mr. Rajda: That's why...

Prabhupada: That will be a great help immediately.

Mr. Rajda: That I'll do immediately. Now only... That's why I was just
inquiring what concrete thing you would like to do.

Prabhupada: Immediately kindly help me, that give at least one hundred men
permanent residential permission. They are not politicians. They are not
interested. They are devotee. Then I can manage this big, big establishment
like Bombay, Vrndavana.

Mr. Rajda: Now tell me with your men written over all this(?). I will give you

Prabhupada: Have you got that, made any list...?

Tamala Krsna: I called for the names, so within a short time.

Prabhupada: That's all. Name is there. So this is the...

Indian (1): First progress thing.

Mr. Rajda: No, no, we'll do this immediately, and even if necessary, I will
fight with the government. They have got to do it. Only thing is if you can
give me some note, what are the hurdles...

Prabhupada: Bring some paper. Write it. Immediately begin to do this. They are
coming from very rich, respectable family. They have not come here to earn
money for exploit India. They have no business to do this. I can guarantee that
they will bring money from America and live here -- not touch a single paisa of
India. Now, suppose there are one hundred Americans, and if I am bringing ten
lakhs of rupees per month, then what is the per capita?

Mr. Rajda: Per capita will show...

Giriraja: Ten thousand.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Indian (1): I... Yeah, complete list. That is why I asked you, "What first step
you wanted to?"

Prabhupada: Kindly help.

Indian (1): Concrete step.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Indian (1): That, Mr. Ratensingh is bound to do.

Prabhupada: Kindly help me.

Mr. Rajda: No, no, we will think ourselves duty-bound. Oh, I feel intensely
about it. There is no question about it.

Prabhupada: And I guarantee that if they take any part in politics, you can
drive away immediately. They have no.... They have given everything. They are
not thinking that they are Americans. Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena
nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. This is the process of bhakti.
Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam. Upadhi. This is upadhi. I am living being, but I have
got some designation, "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim." These are designation. So
then they are M.P... This is designation. You are not M.P... You are living
being, part and parcel of God.

Mr. Rajda: Correct.

Prabhupada: And this designation can be moved, removed at any moment. Indira
Gandhi, no more prime minis... Designation finished. So sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam
[Cc. Madhya 19.170], when one become free all designation, tat-paratvena
nirmalam, simply by Krsna consciousness he becomes purified. Hrsikena
hrsikesa-sevanam bhakti... Then bhakti begins.

brahma-bhutah prasannatma

na socati na kanksati

samah sarvesu bhutesu

mad-bhaktim labhate param

[Bg. 18.54]

This is the preliminary condition. So it means as soon as they have become
devotee, they have no more designation. This conception is not there: "I am
American," "I am Indian," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim" -- no.

Mr. Rajda: Right. Very good.

Prabhupada: Finished. Nirmala. So... So you are giving note?

Tamala Krsna: What would you like in the note?

Mr. Rajda: Just the problem that you...

Prabhupada: Write. What I am saying, write him and give him. This is the most
important point.

Mr. Rajda: Are there any local problems still surviving?

Prabhupada: Our local problem... Now, what about the municipality?

Tamala Krsna: Yes, that's there.

Prabhupada: Write. Why don't you write immediately?

Mr. Rajda: Just give me a note. Wherever I can help, I will definitely do it.
There is complaint, if you... First of all, about this visa, which is very
difficult to be removed, and now...

Prabhupada: In a nice paper you note.

Tamala Krsna: Yes, I'm going to type it down, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Yes. Do it immediately. In the Bhagavata it is said that one hasn't
got to learn Bhagavata, but if he simply says, "Yes, it is is very nice," he
gets some good result. Similarly, our movement is such that if simply one
appreciates, "Yes, it is good..." Your chief minister has accepted, Maharastra
chief minister.

Devotee (2): Yes, Chawan.

Prabhupada: Where is that cutting that was published? He came, all, in Punjab.
So there is no doubt about it, that this is the best humanitarian activities.
So kindly help us as far as possible.

Mr. Rajda: No, I think myself duty-bound. It is very important.

Prabhupada: Thank you very much. (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: I have talked with him also. He's always with me in this public
life, right from the beginning.

Prabhupada: You were also M.P.?

Indian (1): No, I was municipal councilor.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Mr. Rajda: He was a municipal councilor here in Bombay.

Prabhupada: Oh, the municipal councilor... (Hindi) What is that?

Devotee (3): It's Chawan's cutting from the newspaper.

Prabhupada: Why don't you read other? Read it loudly.

Bhakti-caru: "Chief Minister lauds Krishna movement. Krsna consciousness was
the essence of every faith and belonged to the world, Maharastra Chief Minister
Mr. M. P. Chawan said at the Third International Hare Krishna Festival at the
Cross Maidan in Bombay on Wednesday. Mr. Chawan lauded the work done by
Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, Founder-Acharya of the International Society
for Krishna Consciousness. He said that Swami was responsible for popularizing
Krsna consciousness all over the world. Speaking after the chief minister,
Swami Prabhupada emphasized the need for scientific understanding of the
Bhagavad-gita to solve the problems confronting humanity. 'When human society
is without dharma,' he said, 'it becomes animal society.' The festival,
scheduled to end on Tuesday, has been extended another five days."

Prabhupada: So his wife also...

Mr. Rajda: But now, poor fellow, he's also going. That is his fate.

Prabhupada: That's all. This is political struggle. It doesn't matter. A man is
what he is. That's all. And to come to this field of activities, one has to
become free from all designation. "I am the chief minister" or this or that,
that is designation. So I have to give up.

Mr. Rajda: It's a temporary thing.

Prabhupada: Temporary thing. We should not be bothering about these temporary
things. And it is meant for the rulers. Bhagavad-gita, in the fourth chapter,

imam vivasvate yogam

proktavan aham avyayam

vivasvan manave praha

manur iksvakave 'bravit

[Bg. 4.1]

evam parampara-praptam... [Bg. 4.2].

Devotees: Imam rajarsayo viduh.

Prabhupada: Imam rajarsayo viduh. It is meant for the rulers, rajarsi, not for
the loafers. Imam rajarsayo viduh. (Hindi) Our, this monarchy was there, but
they were rajarsis, monarch, at the same time, great saintly person. Therefore
they were worshiped, Maharaja Yudhisthira, Maharaja Pariksit, Maharaja
Ambarisa. They are not autocrat. Imam rajarsayo viduh. They understood the
science of Bhagavad-gita from saintly person, exalted brahmanas. They ruled.
You'll find in Srimad-Bhagavatam this Maharaja Pariksit, grandson of Arjuna.
His father died when he was in the womb of his mother. So all, everyone died.
Only these five brother remained. And Pariksit Maharaja, the grandson of
Arjuna, he was in the womb of his mother Uttara. So he was also attempted to be
killed by Asvatthama by brahmastra. Krsna saved him. So anyway, the
grandfathers took care of this child, baby in the womb. And when he was born...
This is a ceremony, jata-karma. Just after birth there is a ceremony. This is
now gone, dasa, dasa-karana... Nobody is... So they are making horoscope, the
brahmanas. "So this child will be like this, like this, like this, like this,"
Yudhisthira Maharaja's question was that "What you are speaking, that is all
right. Whether this child will be to their forefathers' reputation, how to give
happiness to the subjects, praja-palana?" He was anxious, "How much he will be
qualified, praja-palana, how to keep the prajas very happy? First of all see
that." This was the test, praja-palana. And it is stated in this Bhagavatam...
Now find out this ruling of Yudhisthira Maharaja, that chapter, first part. So
there was not even disease during his reign. Adayo vyadhayah.(?)There was no
extreme heat, there was no extreme cold, on account of his rajarsi. And their
only business was to see... And Lord Ramacandra. How He was maintaining
subjects like father. Therefore people are still hankering after rama-rajya.
There is a chapter, "Maharaja Yudhisthira's Regime." See the Contents. (pause)

Devotee (2): This is when Maharaja Yudhisthira was retiring, or before?

Prabhupada: No, when he was ruling.

Devotee (2): Ruling, yeah.

Prabhupada: The reign of Maharaja Yudhisthira, there is chapter.

Devotee (3): Shall I read?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Devotee (3): "Maharaja Yudhisthira, whose enemy was never born, performed his
daily morning duties by praying, offering fire sacrifice to the sun-god, and
offering obeisances, grains, cows, land and gold to the brahmanas. He then
entered the palace to pay respects to the elderly. However, he could not find
his uncles or aunt, the daughter of King Subala." Should I read the purport?

Prabhupada: No. What is the sloka?


ajata-satruh krta-maitro hutagnir

vipran natva tila-go-bhumi-rukmaih...

Prabhupada: No, the sloka is, beginning is sarva-dugha mahi, like that.
Parjanyah... (pause) Ah. Kamam vavarsa parjanyah sarva-kama-dugha mahi [SB
1.10.4]. Find out this verse.

Giriraja: I can find it.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Giriraja: About how the... There's one... No, 1.2

Prabhupada: This is the verse, kamam vavarsa parjanyah sarva-kama-dugha mahi
[SB 1.10.4]. (Hindi) So vast knowledge.

Giriraja: Should I read?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Giriraja: "During the reign of Maharaja Yudhisthira the clouds showered all the
water that people needed."

Prabhupada: Yes. Read the original verse.

Giriraja: Oh, I'm sorry.

kamam vavarsa parjanyah

sarva-kama-dugha mahi

sisicuh sma vrajan gavah

payasodhasvatir muda

[SB 1.10.4]

Prabhupada: Translation?

Giriraja: "During the reign of Maharaja Yudhisthira the cloud showered all the
water that people needed, and the earth produced all the necessities of man in
profusion. Due to its fatty milk bag and cheerful attitude, the cow used to
moisten the grazing ground with milk."

Prabhupada: (Hindi) Now read the purport.

Lokanatha: "The basic principle of economic development is centered on the land
and cows. The necessities of human society are food grains..."

Prabhupada: About the land and cows, this is Bhagavad-gita, mentioned,
krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. Never recommends
factory. Krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam [Bg. 18.44]. So there is no question of giving
protection to the cows if it gives milk only. No. Go-raksya. There must be
protection to the cow. This is Krsna consciousness. Even the cows pass urine
and stool, that is beneficial. And if it gives milk, then there is no question.
Hm. What is that?

Lokanatha: "The necessities of human society are food grains, fruits, milk,
minerals, clothing, wood, etc. One requires all these items to fulfill the
material needs of the body. Certainly one does not require flesh and fish or
iron tools and machinery. During the regime of Maharaja Yudhisthira, all over
the world there were regulated rainfalls. Rainfalls are not in the control of
the human being. The heavenly King Indradeva is the controller of rains, and he
is the servant of the Lord. When the Lord is obeyed by the king and the people
under the king's administration, there are regulated rains from the horizon,
and these rains are the causes of all varieties of production on the land. Not
only do regulated rains help ample production of grains and fruits, but when
they combine with astronomical influences there is ample production of valuable
stones and pearls. Grains and vegetables can sumptuously feed a man and
animals, and a fatty cow delivers enough milk to supply a man sumptuously with
vigor and vitality. If there is enough milk, enough grains, enough fruit,
enough cotton, enough silk and enough jewels, then why do the people need
cinemas, houses of prostitution, slaughterhouses, etc.? What is the need of an
artificial luxurious life of cinema, cars, radio, flesh and hotels? Has this
civilization produced anything but quarreling individually and nationally? Has
this civilization enhanced the cause of equality and fraternity by sending
thousands of men into a hellish factory and the war fields at the whims of a
particular man?

It is said here that the cows used to moisten the pasturing land with milk
because their milk bags were fatty and the animals were joyful. Do they not
require, therefore, proper protection for a joyful life by being fed with a
sufficient quantity of grass in the field? Why should men kill cows for their
selfish purposes? Why should man not be satisfied with grains, fruits and milk,
which, combined together, can produce hundreds and thousands of palatable
dishes. Why are there slaughterhouses all over the world to kill innocent
animals? Maharaja Pariksit, grandson of Maharaja Yudhisthira, while touring his
vast kingdom, saw a black man attempting to kill a cow. The King at once
arrested the butcher and chastised him sufficiently. Should not a king or
executive head protect the lives of the poor animals who are unable to defend
themselves? Is this humanity? Are not the animals of a country citizens also?
Then why are they allowed to be butchered in organized slaughterhouses? Are
these the signs of equality, fraternity and nonviolence?

Therefore, in contrast with the modern, advanced, civilized form of government,
an autocracy like Maharaja Yudhisthira's is by far superior to a so-called
democracy in which animals are killed and a man less than an animal is allowed
to cast votes for another less-than-animal man.

We are all creatures of material nature. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said that
the Lord Himself is the seed-giving father and material nature is the mother of
all living beings in all shapes. Thus mother material nature has enough
foodstuff both for animals and for men, by the grace of the Father Almighty,
Sri Krsna. The human being is the elder brother of all other living beings. He
is endowed with intelligence more powerful than animals for realizing the
course of nature and the indications of the Almighty Father. Human
civilizations should depend on the production of material nature without
artificially attempting economic development to turn the world into a chaos of
artificial greed and power only for the purpose of artificial luxuries and
sense gratification. This is but the life of dogs and hogs."

Prabhupada: Simply fighting. They are not peaceful. That's all. Where is peace?
You'll be surprised. During gas scarcity the gas was being supplied in
Honolulu. This was in our presence. So the gas supply, whatever they had,
distributed, and they had one sign board, "No more gas." So next man was so
angry that he shot him dead. Just see. He had no more gas; he cannot supply. He
became so much infuriated that he shot him dead. This is the result of this
modern motorcar civilization. He thought that "Gas will not be supplied. Then I
am gone. I am finished. So kill this man." This is education. (Hindi) Provided
we train at least some ideal men, everything can be done. Everything is there.
There is no scarcity of knowledge in India. We have to simply take it and
practically apply it, bas. (Hindi) We are not sentimental (laughs) religious
group. Everything practical. Krsna consciousness is not like that, sentiment.
Everything scientific, practical, for the good of the whole human society.
Therefore I require that this must be pushed on for the whole human society,
and naturally India also. (aside:) The prasadam arrangement is...? You give
each item, one each... No, no, give me, give me, give... This is... Each item,
you give one. I have got this ambition that Indian culture should be spread,
and otherwise what can I do wherever...?

Mr. Rajda: And you have already done lot of great, noble work.

Prabhupada: Yes, they say at least.

Mr. Rajda: It is a great movement. Naturally your Bhagavad-gita should be given
importance. It must be delivered to every corner of the world.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: It is your...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Mr. Rajda: ...desire, I put it.

Prabhupada: They'll be happy. They're suffering. (Hindi) Is that civilization?
"You could not supply me petrol. I shot you." What is this? How much
animalistic a human being can be. (aside:) Wake up. Kama esa krodha esah. The
people are being educated to become too much lusty, and as soon as their lust
is not fulfilled, they'll be angry. Kama esa krodha esa rajo-guna-samudbhavah.
And the krodha was, anger was so intense that he killed another person. No
consideration that "What he can do? The petrol is finished." He simply says,
"Now my stock is finished." So therefore he should be killed?

Mr. Rajda: Now this information will.... I shall be interested to read from it.

Prabhupada: So where is that note? Bring. (Hindi) Those who are assisting me,
let them have permanent visa so that I can work this way.

Mr. Rajda: Correct.

Prabhupada: And I am unnecessarily spending five to six lakhs of rupees.

Mr. Rajda: No, this was not mentioned, never mentioned before me. I will
definitely take it up when I go to Delhi. And then on 25th, the first thing
I'll do...

Prabhupada: No, we approached that Brahmananda Reddy.

Mr. Rajda: Reddy's not there. They are all gone.

Prabhupada: No, before that I met him.

Indian (1): Now Your Grace will have to speak either with the prime minister
straight, and he will swiftly done.

Mr. Rajda: No, that was the... The prime minister himself will nullify(?). No,
he will immediately grasp what is the... 'Cause I have already talked...

Prabhupada: When I was in Delhi, there was one day a meeting at Brahmananda's
place, so I personally requested. So he noted down. That's all. So he's the
chief man, home member.

Indian (1): Home member. But the last day his powers were very much limited in
home matter. He had to look after the home ministry. And possibly...

Mr. Rajda: There was too much power struggle in those days. That is the main

Prabhupada: In Delhi...

Mr. Rajda: Everyone was struggling for his own existence in that power, in
that... Some of the people...

Indian (1): Now we have got a government. The chief man of the...

Prabhupada: Government.

Indian (1): ...the team, he is an intensely religious-minded man.

Prabhupada: That is...

Indian (1): Delivering Bhagavad-gita.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Indian (1): Practicing the principle of Bhagavad-gita. So to him we can appeal.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Indian (1): And it will, appeal go straight home.

Prabhupada: And therefore I am so much on the..., that a man, harav abhakta. He
is bhagavad-bhakta. (Hindi) This is another proposition.


jatih sastram japas tapah

apranasyeva dehasya

mandanam loka-ranjanam

"Anyone who has no devotional life, for him, belonging to the great family
great nation, jati..." Bhagavad-bhakti-hinasya jatih tapah. "All austerity,
penance, everything is just like decorating the dead body." Just like a body
minus life, so what is the use of decorating with sal and silcram(?).
Similarly, any person who may be very highly posted, but if he has no
bhagavad-bhakti, then it is decoration.


jatih sastram japas tapah

apranasyeva dehasya

mandanam loka-ranjanam

That is little applause from the foolish public. Otherwise...

Lokanatha: The requisition finished in next few minutes.

Prabhupada: How many minutes? They have been detaining few minutes. Just bring
immediately. You cannot detain all these important men. They have got other

Mr. Rajda: No, there is no other thing. Only thing, the roads are functioning,
Bombay, and I have to visit them.

Prabhupada: Yes. What is that?

Tamala Krsna: "To Ratansingh Rajda, Member of Parliament, Bombay. Dear Sri
Rajda, We thank you very much for visiting us at Hare Krishna Land and for
sympathetically hearing our divine master Srila Prabhupada. His Divine Grace
mentioned several difficulties which are impeding his great work, and you have
been kind enough to promise to remove these obstacles. 1) Our men are regularly
being asked to leave India. How can we manage such important projects when our
men are forced to leave? Every year we have to send so many men away from India
and then again we have to bring them back. For every man who comes and goes
like this, we have to spend Rs. 10,000, and in this way we are wasting not less
than Rs. five to six lakhs each year. Our men should be given permanent
residence in India. The United States Government granted Srila Prabhupada a
permanent residency visa so that he could fulfill his mission in the USA.
Similarly, Srila Prabhupada's foreign disciples should be given permanent
residency in India. Srila Prabhupada requires at least one hundred men to
remain in India, and he is prepared to bring Rs. ten lakhs, foreign exchange,
per month just to maintain them. They will not have to seek employment, they
are not interested in politics, and they will not touch one paisa locally for
their maintenance. Rather, they will bring money. Therefore we request that the
government of India should grant permission for at least one hundred of our
men. 2) Locally we are being troubled by the municipal corporation. The local
councilor is trying to take over ten feet..." [break]

Mr. Rajda: ...evening. And we shall see what is in the meeting. And I am
meeting the commissioner also on Tuesday. So...

Prabhupada: Note it.

Tamala Krsna: I'll do that.

Prabhupada: What is that?

Tamala Krsna: I'm putting in an envelope.

Prabhupada: Bring. I want that at least at the weekend respectable gentlemen
come here, live here, try to understand the philosophy, and if possible render
some service. That's all. We have got now nice building. Every room is air
conditioned. Not that you have to go to the jungle. (laughs)

Mr. Rajda: No, it's a nice atmosphere.

Prabhupada: For us, we can live underneath a tree. But if I would have lived
underneath a tree, you would not have come. (laughter) Therefore this building
is required. So give them, one each, this magazine, latest edition. Here is.
Mr. Rajda, Mr. Parik. Rajda's copy is in the red binding? That's it. No. Give
him. Give him.

Mr. Rajda: So we thank you very much.

Prabhupada: Thank you very much for your coming. Hare Krsna. Jaya. (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: Before leaving, I will come again, after 24th, here.

Indian (1): Thereafter, I will come, no? Once in a week or at least a

Prabhupada: And you are Parik.

Indian (1): Yes.

Prabhupada: You can study whether we are genuine or bogus, pariks.(?) Thank
you. Hare Krsna. Jaya.

Devotees: Haribol!

Prabhupada: Jaya. (Hindi) (guests leave) What is that?

Devotee (2): I'm just fixing the bedspread.

Prabhupada: We have got these chairs. Why you should use apara(?)...

Tamala Krsna: Yeah. No more of these...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: ...for guests.

Prabhupada: This may be... Make it comfortable.

Tamala Krsna: From now on, I'll... [break]

Prabhupada: That is not possible in the dog. A human being can do. So this
opportunity is there, and people are not giving them this opportunity. This is
the greatest harmful civilization. They are keeping them in ignorance for that.
Anyway, if people agree to take our guidance, we can change the face of the
world. That is a fact. Whole world will be peaceful immediately.

Tamala Krsna: Maybe a possible name for this could be "Krsna: Messiah of the
Harijanas." 'Cause he published, "Who is..." They need a messiah.

Prabhupada: Every one of us messiah. Anyone Krsna conscious, he's the messiah.
Every one. Why one? All of us. Gaurangera bhakta-gane, jane jane sakti dhari,
brahmanda tari saksi(?): "The devotee of Lord Caitanya, every one has so
immense power that every one, they can deliver the whole universe." Gaurangera
bhakta-jane, jane jane sakti..., brahmanda tari... That is Gauranga's men.

Tamala Krsna: Only you are that powerful, Srila Prabhupada. We're like...

Prabhupada: Why you are not? You are my disciples.

Tamala Krsna: We're like the bugs.

Prabhupada: "Like father, like son." You should be. Gaurangera bhakta..., jane.
Everyone. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei
desa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. He asked everyone, "Just become guru." Follow His
instruction. You become guru. Amara ajnaya. Don't manufacture ideas. Amara
ajnaya. "What I say, you do. You become a guru." Where is the difficulty? "And
what is Your ajna?" Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Bas.
Everything is there in the Bhagavad-gita. You simply repeat. That's all. You
become guru. To become a guru is not difficult job. Follow Caitanya Mahaprabhu
and speak what Krsna has said. Bas. You become guru.

Tamala Krsna: We live in Bombay 54. This man lives in Bombay 52.

Prabhupada: So it is somewhere near.

Tamala Krsna: It must be pretty near.

Giriraja: I think, Bandara(?).

Tamala Krsna: First rows(?).

Giriraja: Bandara or Khar(?).

Prabhupada: So contact him. If he's sincere, let him cooperate with us. We'll
make everything nice. And if they want to eat hog's flesh and wine, at the same
time become harijana, (laughs) that is not possible.

Tamala Krsna: So there's certain stipulations to our taking responsibility for
the one hundred million harijanas.

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. We can take them. Why one hundred million? Whole universe
we can take. It is Krsna ... Method is simple: you have to follow Caitanya
Mahaprabhu and speak Bhagavad-gita. Bas. Where is the difficulty? Why one
hundred million? All, whole universe we can take, provided they are prepared.
Our business is not difficult. What Caitanya Mahaprabhu has said we have to
execute and speak Bhagavad-gita. Bas. What I am doing? These two things are.
Not at all. But these rascal will not take. They will manufacture their own way
of life. That is the... That is dog's obstinacy. Therefore Rsabhadeva says,
"Don't become hog and dog here." Nayam deho deha-bhajam kastan kaman arhate
vid-bhujam. The difficulty is that you can preach nice thing, but they will not

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: Then what can be done? A man has fallen in the dark well, crying.
You give him one rope: "Catch it." But he'll not catch. Then how you can
deliver? Let him suffer. So he had asked him to go to the municipal...?

Giriraja: Yes, 3:30 on Monday. These M.P.'s are just here for a few days, and
they have very busy schedule. So I have arranged for one man to come tomorrow.
He can see you... [break]

Prabhupada: So? Now, this nationalism idea, so you have trace out the whole
history. By introducing this nationalism, what improvement gave? Nationalism,
the leader, it began in Europe, the Romans. They wanted to spread. Where are
the Romans now? Carthagian, old history, Egyptian, Grecian, then, later on,
Moguls or then British. So where are these groups? "Combined together, exploit
others." That was, that means, a gang of rogues. Rogues and thieves, they...
And by doing that, what they have actually done? The Romans, now their broken
buildings are there. And people go to see the fun, how they used to enjoy. What
is that called?

Tamala Krsna: Coliseum. That's the Greek Coliseum, they...

Prabhupada: By keeping one lion and fighting him and it is enjoyed. What is
this? What they have gained? In this way, the privileged... Is it not subject
perception? What Napoleon has done? Or Hitler has done? Or Churchill has done?

Tamala Krsna: What about nationalism here in India?

Prabhupada: They are imitating. What Gandhi has done? These things are
cheating, spoiled. Then they have now a slogan to drive away poverty.
Vivekananda imitated, daridra-narayana-seva. So Vivekananda started his mission
in India hundred years ago. Why there are so many daridras lying on the street
at night? Hm? Everywhere. Here you can say, "India is poverty-stricken." That
is your imagination. Accepting that, those who are materially opulent, why they
are also, they're lying on the street? Why in Bowery Street they are lying on
the street? Why in the Bedford Park English boys are lying on street?

Tamala Krsna: I don't know... One verse can be quoted that because of one's
connection with the modes of material nature...

Prabhupada: Amsterdam, who they, lying on the street in center of Europe? What
have they done about these poor? On the other hand, the poor have learned how
to utilize unrestricted sex and indulge in gambling and intoxication.

Tamala Krsna: For example, in America we find that the less intelligent persons
are engaging in illicit sex life, so naturally they have more children, and
they're eating meat, so the children are very...

Prabhupada: And female... And women, girls.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah.

Prabhupada: As the man becomes unrestricted in sex life, he has no potency.
Either he becomes impotent or he can bring out some girls. We see practically
from our association. Mostly they are begetting girls.

Tamala Krsna: From our what, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Our association.

Tamala Krsna: Our society.

Prabhupada: Those who are married society. These boys are begetting mostly
girl, because they have lost their potency.

Tamala Krsna: I know most of our life members, because they're a little bit
regulated, mostly sons-three sons, one daughter; four sons, one daughter. It's
very common.

Prabhupada: Yes. If not equal quality...

Tamala Krsna: At least...

Prabhupada: So we have to touch all these. Then poverty... And "Drive away
poverty. Give them more money." More money means cheating. You are employing; I
am employed. Begins from government. More money and printing, they are coming.
If I have got power to print paper and distribute it as money, you are
dissatisfied, getting hundred rupees, you want two hundred, so what is to me? I
print and give you. This is artificial inflation.

Tamala Krsna: More money means printing more bills.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah, but you haven't increased the...

Prabhupada: And your enemy country, they're actually happy. They print exactly
money like this. They come and purchase goods and give you fortune, anybody. I
know. Then what is the difficulty? Suppose this American dollar, is it very
difficult to print? So the Chinese, they are America's enemy, they can print,
bring millions of dollars and purchase from your country and export to his
country and give you some paper. You are... What you can do?

Tamala Krsna: Well, we can only hope that we'll catch them. We hope that we'll
catch them.

Prabhupada: That is another thing, "when we catch." Who will catch? "Bell the
cat." It is going on. I know. During wartime, one Chinese man was coming from
China, and one business friend, he was appointed his purchasing agent. He was
giving a list of goods to purchase. And this man, whatever money he'll charge,
he'll immediately-Indian currency. He'll not say, "Why so much price?" No. Then
he will pack up the goods and through some channel he'll dispatch it. That is
also through our way, not in the... The China is in on the border. There also,
if you pay money, smuggler's rate... They try to do.

Tamala Krsna: That seems to be a big issue now, these smugglers. I notice in
the newspapers every day.

Prabhupada: The smugglers get with money, printed money. Who can check it?

Tamala Krsna: So printed money should have gold behind it.

Prabhupada: Yes, that is the theory. What is the rate of economy?

Tamala Krsna: What is the idea...

Prabhupada: That is called...

Tamala Krsna: Gold standard.

Prabhupada: Not gold standard, but there is a technical name. That means if you
print notes, currency note, immediately you have to keep stock of gold in the
reserve bank. Reserve. Therefore it is called...

Tamala Krsna: The gold reserves.

Prabhupada: Gold reserve. Gold reserve, yes. At least forty percent.

Tamala Krsna: What's the idea behind that?

Prabhupada: What is that? The idea is cheating. The cheating business begins
from the government. And why people will not learn to cheat? This is cheating.
I am giving you one paper, one hundred rupees, dollars, and you are happy: "I
have got so many ..." I am giving you check, ten thousand dollars. You got ten
thousand dollars. Now I give you a paper. But it is going on. We have made
machinery in such a way that it will go on in hundred rupees or ten thousand
rupees. Just like this fixed deposit. I am giving actual money; they are giving
a receipt. And it will increase. What increase? The same paper. And gradually
inflation is going on. They'll pay at the inflation rate.

Tamala Krsna: Well, they say they're paying at the investment rate.

Prabhupada: That is, mean, their plea. Really, today... Just like in our
childhood my father had three hundred rupees, and that three hundred rupees is
now ten thousand. So if my father would have deposited three hundred rupees at
that time, automatically he has become ten thousand... So if you pay me instead
of three hundred, say, six hundred or eight hundred, what is your loss? It has
already become ten thousand.

Tamala Krsna: Well, it's practical also, because supposing I have a cow...

Prabhupada: But it may be... This cheating is going on.

Tamala Krsna: But is it... What I'm asking is this: Supposing you have a cow,
and you give to me a cow, so from that cow I get from you...

Prabhupada: That I understand, that in twenty years you get another..., same
money. That is another. But another side is the money is gradually losing its
purchasing value.

Tamala Krsna: That's a fact. That's a fact.

Prabhupada: My father with three hundred rupees, he was... What he was doing?
If you want to do that thing now, you'll require ten thousand.

Tamala Krsna: That means some cheating is going on.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: Government, through the government.

Prabhupada: Somewhere or other. Things are there. The rice are there, the dal
is there, the cloth is there, but what he purchased at three hundred rupees,
now you have to pay ten thousand.

Tamala Krsna: That means they've introduced more and more notes without any
gold in their banks. Very dangerous.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: Cheating. That's cheating.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: What is the implication of this cheating? What are the
ramifications, the results?

Prabhupada: Result is that as we say always, that conditioned soul has a
tendency to cheat. So they are utilizing this conditional qualification.

Tamala Krsna: With which result?

Prabhupada: Result is nothing. Therefore we say it is dogs' race, imagination
that "We are becoming happy." He's becoming implicated in karma, cheating
karma, and losing the opportunity of human life. Instead of applying his energy
and intelligence how to become Krsna conscious and get out of this, he is
becoming expert in cheating and suffering. Then you become mouse. Unless you
cheat, you cannot eat even.

Tamala Krsna: So the leaders of government, they are encouraging like that.
Instead of encouraging honesty and work according to the varnas, catur-varnyam,
they are doing like this to become...

Prabhupada: There is no honesty all over the world. It is a forgotten. "These
are primitive," they say, "Now, the honesty, to become pious, to become
religious. These are simply primitive idea." We have to open this. That is a
specific subject matter of that... But we have to write very nicely. Everything
is based on tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13].

Tamala Krsna: The rascals also argue that... The materialists argue that we're
being cheated.

Prabhupada: Hm?

Tamala Krsna: The materialists' argument is that we are being cheated by being
promised something imaginary.

Prabhupada: We are not discussing that, but you are cheating -- that is
practical. You are cheating. Your government is cheating, giving a piece of
paper, cheating me that "You get hundred rupees."

Tamala Krsna: And their cheating in so many... Just like they were paying
ninety rupees for a vasectomy, to make someone impotent, to make them sterile,
they're giving ninety rupees. They're saying "This ninety rupees is worth...
It's worth it to become sterile if you take this ninety rupees."

Prabhupada: That is paper.

Tamala Krsna: Now, that's cheating. A man can produce a son. A son has got real
value in so many ways, but instead they'll give that paper worth...

Prabhupada: Cheated with ninety rupees, and he's no more...

Tamala Krsna: Just like the foreigners bought the island of Manhattan for
twenty-four dollars from the Indians, the native Indians in New York,
twenty-four dollars' worth of trinkets. And they purchased.

Prabhupada: No, the land was there. Just like Bhaktivinoda Thakura purchased
Mayapura at eight annas a bigha.

Tamala Krsna: Now...

Prabhupada: Two thousand rupees.

Tamala Krsna: And they want five thousand. Same land.

Prabhupada: Land value has increased.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah, they say that land, buying land, is better investment than
putting your money in the bank, so much increasing.

Prabhupada: And they'll not allow. Rather, I cannot purchase land instead of
keeping in the bank. They will not allow.

Tamala Krsna: No, they won't.

Prabhupada: You can purchase, at most, sixty bighas. That's all.

Tamala Krsna: Right. Then you get to... But what about the cheating going on,
big cheating, international cheating about the space flights?

Prabhupada: Everything is cheating because so long you are a conditioned soul,
out of four defects, one of the defects is cheating propensity, karana patava,
er, vipralipsa.(?) That is a qualification. And in this material world, the
more you are expert cheater, you are considered very able man. All over the
world, so many expert cheaters are going on.

Devotee (4): Are these people consciously cheating or raised in cheating so
that they don't know the difference?

Prabhupada: That is another thing, but they are cheating. That is a fact. How
we have learnt it, that is another thing. But you are cheating. That's fact.

Devotee (4): Just like this President Carter, though, he's supposed to be a
religious man and bringing so-called honesty into government, compared to the

Prabhupada: That, everyone says.

Tamala Krsna: And this, these space flight cheatings, this is for the purpose
of giving a few men more tax money or fame. That's another reason for cheating,
to get fame.

Prabhupada: I have got tendency to cheat, so people unnecessarily poses himself
as very big man even by ideas that you will consider him very great man,
although I am nothing. So many gurus, they are doing that. Our business that we
want to speak what Krsna has said. If Krsna has cheated, then we are cheater.
Otherwise honest. If Krsna is honest, we are honest. If Krsna is cheater, so
our position is safe. Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128].
Other gurus, they are manufacturing how to cheat. That is the difference. We
are not speaking anything new. So if Krsna has originally cheated you, then I
am cheater.

Tamala Krsna: That's a... A big cheating is going on in the form of
speculating. Just like the, all of the teachers, professors... I was reading
Satsvarupa's book. Satsvarupa was presenting that there's three ways of
acquiring knowledge, you know. First way is by sense perception. But that's
cheating, because...

Prabhupada: Hm, pratyaksa, paroksa aitihya.

Tamala Krsna: The senses cheat us because they're imperfect.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: One thing looks like the wrong thing.

Prabhupada: Call Gopinatha.

Tamala Krsna: But he points out that the final method, which is to hear from
one who actually knows, that is the best way.

Prabhupada: That is our... And who knows better than Krsna? That's all. That is
Krsna consciousness.

Tamala Krsna: Satsvarupa gives the example: Shakespeare is the expert on
Shakespeare. Krsna is the expert on Krsna.

Prabhupada: That is good. Very nice.

Devotee (4): He's coming, Prabhupada. He was just in the shower.

Prabhupada: So we have to discuss very thoroughly all these subject matter.

Tamala Krsna: Another form of cheating is done by man and women for sex life.
Just like a woman cheats by putting on all this makeup with the idea that "I
will attract someone for my sense pleasure." And the man promises so many
things: "I will take care of you. I will do this. I will do that."

Prabhupada: Well, first of all, if you accept that you have got the cheating
propensity, then all other things come.

Tamala Krsna: Right. So many things, everything. Yeah, practically this whole
civilization now is a cheating civili


15 de abril de 1977

Prabhupada: Srimad Bhagavatam-Puranam amalam. Este é o fato lamentável,
que temos na Índia, o conhecimento real.

Mr. Rajda: Real ...?

Prabhupada: O conhecimento real. E nós temos trancado esse conhecimento.

Mr. Rajda: Temos fechado. Esse é o maior crime que cometeram.

Índia (1): Nós não lhe permitiu crescer em todo o mundo.

Prabhupada: Jnana khala. Sarasvati jnana-Khale sati yatha. Há um versículo
como este no Srimad-Bhagavatam. Jnana-Khale. Se você tem alguma
conhecimento, você deve distribuí-lo. Isso vai te glorificamos, e não que "eu tenho
tenho algum conhecimento. Eu vou manter isso em segredo. "Assim, a Índia tem essa enorme exaltado
conhecimento da vida espiritual, e que está preso. Estamos imitando o
Western cachorro dançando. Isso eu queria trazer para o seu anúncio. Isto não vai fazer
nenhum bem. Então, algum arranjo que deve ser feito o conhecimento do exaltado
A Índia tem de ser distribuído. Que eu comecei com a minha humilde ...

Mr. Rajda: Não, isso é muito bem feito.

Prabhupada: Mas eu não tenho a cooperação das autoridades públicas. Isso é mais
lamentável. Então agora não há mudança de governo.

Mr. Rajda: Sim.

Prabhupada: E Morarji é uma pessoa muito religiosa.

Mr. Rajda: Sim, ele é um homem muito religioso.

Prabhupada: Então por que não tentar? pelo menos, manter uma instituição ideal. Assim como
de conhecimento técnico, se houver uma boa faculdade de medicina de qualquer parte do
mundo, as pessoas vão lá sem qualquer consideração de nacionalidade ou qualquer outra coisa.
Da mesma forma que haja uma instituição ideal na Índia para que o mundo inteiro
virá de lá.

Mr. Rajda: Nós tivemos as universidades, Taka (?), Silandar (?), E Narandhara ...

Prabhupada: Sim.

Mr. Rajda: ... nos tempos antigos.

Prabhupada: Sim.

Mr. Rajda: E as pessoas de todo o mundo estavam chegando.

Prabhupada: Então por que você não convidar agora?

Mr. Rajda: Muito.

Prabhupada: Nós vamos lá para imitar a sua tecnologia. Mas quem vem aqui para
aprender alguma coisa?

Mr. Rajda: Muito bem, muito bem.

Prabhupada: Mas nós temos. O exemplo já está configurado. Esses meninos, eles
não vim aqui para aprender o seu ciclo de produção. Eles têm o suficiente de

Mr. Rajda: Essa questão do ciclo que está fazendo.

Prabhupada: E nós estamos orgulhosos de produção e ciclo de máquina de costura. De modo que
é o meu pedido, que eu comecei. Torná-lo uma instituição organizada que
as pessoas de todas as partes do mundo ...

Mr. Rajda: Será que chega aqui.

Prabhupada: ... ia vir aqui e aprender esse conhecimento. Trata-se de Caitanya
missão Mahaprabhu. missão de Caitanya Mahaprabhu é ...

Mr. Rajda: Missão Gaudiya.

Prabhupada: Não missão Gaudiya. missão de Caitanya, o Senhor Caitanya. Você sabe
Senhor Caitanya.

Mr. Rajda: Sim, sim, sim Caitanya Mahaprabhu.

Prabhupada: Então, Ele declara que Bharata-bhumite manusya-janma Haila yara: [Cc.
Adi 9,41] "Qualquer um que tomou nascimento como humano gatos que não pode ser, e os cães ..."
Gatos e cachorros, eles simplesmente pular a noite inteira: "Gow! Gow! Gow!" Isso é
outro ... Encontramos tantos cães, a noite inteira ocupado, assistindo. Cuja propriedade se
está assistindo? Mas ele ... Ele tem esse negócio, muito ocupado. Assim como alguns
motociclo ou algum ... ", Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow!" observando, observando,
assistindo. Assim, portanto, este é um negócio de cães e gatos. Mas o ser humano
negócio é diferente. Portanto Caitanya Mahaprabhu disse, Bharata-bhumite
Haila manusya-janma yara: [Cc. Adi 9,41] "Qualquer um que tomou nascimento como um ser humano
estar em Portugal, Bharata-bhumi ... "Janma sarthaka kari 'kara n upakara:
"Primeiro de tudo fazer a sua vida perfeita" - você tem a oportunidade, védica
Cultura - "e depois distribuir o conhecimento de todo o mundo para fazer o bem
para toda a sociedade humana. "Isso vai glorificar o prestígio de Portugal. Então, por que
Não é possível continuar este? Haja uma instituição totalmente, seguindo os princípios
do Bhagavad-Gita, o Bhagavad-Gita Como Ele É. Então as pessoas vão ser beneficiadas. Se você
dizer: "É secular," Bhagavad-Gita é para cada homem. Não há dúvida de
Hindu, muçulmana, cristã ou isto ou aquilo, não. Quando Krsna diz,

dehino 'smin yatha dehe

jara yauvanam kaumaram

tatha dehantara-praptir

dhiras tatra nd muhyati

Bg [. 2,13]

Portanto, esta crescendo ... A criança está crescendo para se tornar um menino. Um menino está crescendo a
tornar-se um homem jovem. Um rapaz está a crescer para se tornar um homem velho. Então, qual é o
secular? Todo mundo cresce. Será que isso significa, quando se fala no Bhagavad-Gita,
é apenas significou para os hindus?

Mr. Rajda: É actividades universal.

Prabhupada: É universal, a ciência. É a ciência. Então, por que esta ciência é
medalhão mantido e distorcida pelos líderes? Se você entender uma linha de
Bhagavad-Gita, sua vida se torna bem-sucedida. Agora os nossos dirigentes são supostos
leia Bhagavad-Gita, mas que entende esta linha, tatha dehantara-praptir
dhiras tatra nd muhyati [Bg. 2,13]? Ninguém entende. E eles são estudiosos
do Bhagavad-Gita. Eles não conseguem entender esta linha no início. Este
está acontecendo. Assim, gostaria de pedir-lhe para levar este assunto a sério e ... E
está sendo respondido. Estou escrevendo esses livros sobre o Bhagavad-Gita,
Srimad-Bhagavatam, e estamos vendendo diária no valor de cinco a seis lakhs "de livros.
Em um país estrangeiro, onde seu sistema religioso é diferente, e durante
Festa de Natal que estamos vendendo nossos livros, grande quantidade.

Mr. Rajda: Isso é uma coisa nova, não, uma coisa nova.

Prabhupada: Então, se há algo importante ... Eles são inteligentes.

Mr. Rajda: pessoas inteligentes.

Prabhupada: Por que eles deveriam aceitar isso? E esta é a tentativa de um homem.

Mr. Rajda: Tem que ser institucionalizadas.

Prabhupada: Sim. Por que não fazer isso? Esta mudança política, essa política
modificar a situação, ele vai continuar. Hoje você é poderoso. Amanhã eu sou
poderosa. Isso não faz qualquer diferença. Indira Gandhi foi tão poderosa. Em
um dia tudo acabado. Assim pode ser terminado, a minha posição. Mohitam
nabhijanati mam ebhyah param avyayam [Bg. 7,13]. Tribhir bhavaih gunamayair.
Eles não sabem, por trás de todas essas atividades há uma pessoa que pode fazer
Ele gosta de nada. Então, o que para saber sobre ele? Então essas coisas estão lá
na Índia. O conhecimento não é segredo. Ela está aberta. Assim, sem distorcê-la,
sem quebrá-lo e estragá-lo, porque não dar-lhe como é para o benefício
de toda a humanidade? Você é jovem. Você pode pensar sobre.

Índia (1): Com uma comissão.

Prabhupada: Mas ...

Mr. Rajda: Com as suas bênçãos ... Com a sua bênção que eu posso ter a certeza de ser capaz
fazer alguma coisa.

Prabhupada: Sim.

Mr. Rajda: Da última vez que tinha falado sobre isso, e em Nova Deli, na verdade, eu estava em
à beira de organizar a reunião, mas nunca aqui. Mas então nossas Giriraja
me telefonou e, em deferência à sua saúde que não organizar essa reunião
em Nova Deli. Quando Morarji bhai está vindo para cá, veremos que ...

Prabhupada: Sim. Primeiro de tudo você pode falar. Não se espera que todos
será capaz de compreender. Não é esperado.

sahasresu manusyanam

yatati kascid siddhaye

siddhanam api yatatam

Vetti mam kascin tattvatah

Bg [. 7.3]

Não é fácil tarefa. Mas ainda assim, alguma instituição ideal deveria estar lá, que são
realmente sério para entender. Podem ser dada a oportunidade. Isso deve ser
ali. Na universidade, quando éramos estudantes, havia cerca de pós-graduação
classes que nenhum estudante estava por vir. Mas, ainda assim, a universidade sustentou que
classe, pagando, naqueles dias, 1.200, 1.500, os salários para os professores. Eles
afirmou que. Portanto, aqui não há questão de salário. Aqui a instituição
deve ser mantida, seguindo estritamente os princípios do Bhagavad-Gita. É
aberto. Não é difícil. Assim como Krsna diz que a vida perfeita, como
um pode se tornar perfeito, o homem-mana bhava mad-mam namaskuru bhakto mad-Yaji: [Bg.
18,65] "Sempre penso em mim," homem-Manah, "apenas se Meu devoto," bhaktah-louca,
"Me adoram", namaskuru mam mad-Yaji ", simplesmente oferecer a seus reverências a Mim".
Um, dois, três, quatro-quatro itens. Se você fizer um ponto, pelo menos, a sua vida
torna-se bem-sucedida. Mesmo que esta criança pode fazer isso. Então, para entender o Bhagavad-Gita
e seguem o princípio - não de todo difícil. Não é reservada para qualquer
classe particular de homens ou de um país ou sociedade, como uma coisa agradável, e os recursos humanos
corpo é significado para a compreensão desse conhecimento, para não imitar os gatos e
cães, saltando. Isso está sendo feito pelos cães e gatos. Por evolutiva
processo, quando chegamos à forma de vida humana, é destinado para a compreensão
desta ciência. Então, esta oportunidade existe, mas estamos a bloquear-lhes que não
ter esse conhecimento e tentar compreender como saltar, como gatos e cães.
Maior desserviço à sociedade humana. Temos essa chance, então ao invés
de ajudá-lo a ter a oportunidade, se eu enganá-lo de outra forma, não é
maior desserviço?

Mr. Rajda: Sim.

Prabhupada: Isso está sendo feito em todo o mundo. Se você simplesmente compreender
esta linha, tatha dehantara praptih ... Bg [. 2,13]. Então, hoje eu sou índio, e
após a morte de me tornar outra coisa. Há 8,4 milhões de diferentes organismos.
Hoje eu posso ser ministro muito exaltado, e amanhã, se eu me tornar algo
mais ... Vou ter que, porque a lei da natureza, você não pode verificar. Dehant Tatha ...
Assim como aqui é criança. Você não pode verificar a tornar-se jovem. Isso não está em
seu poder. Ela deve tornar-se ele deve ou se tornar. Da mesma forma tatha,
praptih dehantara, ele não está na sua mão ou na minha mão. É na mão de
a prakrti. kriyamanani Prakrteh gunaih sarvasah karmani, ahamkara-vimudhatma
Bg [. 3,27]. Portanto, há tantas coisas que ... A sociedade humana requer esse
conhecimento e nós estamos tentando dar a este conhecimento por si só com o nosso humilde
tentativa, e estes estrangeiros estão ajudando com seus pranair arthair dhiya
vaca, por sua vida, seu dinheiro, por sua inteligência, por suas palavras.
(Aparte:) Dê-lhes pad. Eles não podem sentar-se confortavelmente. Há pad. Dê-lhe.
Pads. Sim. Não, não. Oh. (Hindi) asinah Sukham. (?) Em primeiro lugar é preciso ... Dar
dela. Então temos, pelo menos, em Bombaim, o lugar mais importante na Índia,
esta instituição. Então venha aqui. Tente entender a filosofia. Não há
dificuldade. Mas nós negligenciamos isso. Estamos simplesmente ne ... e distorção. Todo mundo está
dando sua própria interpretação. Eh? Então, quando, onde está a importância de Krsna?
Se o Bhagavad-Gita é um livro que é a autoridade, e se você interpretar e dar a sua
própria interpretação, então onde está a autoridade? Suponha que o Parlamento passa uma
lei, e se eu interpretar do meu jeito, então onde está a autoridade da lei?
Essa é a idéia. Se você quiser dar alguma idéia de sua preferência, dar-lhe
separadamente. Por que você acha que Bhagavad-Gita e distorcê-lo? Isso não é
cavalheiresco, este. Nós estamos apresentando, portanto, Bhagavad-Gita como ele é, e
está sendo aceita. E antes que me swamis tantos yogis fui lá. Eles também
tentou explicar Bhagavad-Gita, mas ninguém aceita. Não foi ... No
história não era um devoto de Krsna único antes do meu curso. Agora há
milhares de pessoas. Por quê? O segredo é que estou apresentando como ela é.

Mr. Rajda: Como é, exatamente.

Prabhupada: Não há distorção, sem batota. Este é o segredo. Eles me dão
crédito, "Swamiji, você tem feito maravilhoso. Você tem feito ..." Eu digo que o segredo
de maravilhoso é esse, que eu não distorcida dele. Eu apresentei
Bhagavad-Gita como ele é. É segredo de polichinelo.

Mr. Rajda: Isso cria ... Criou ... Suas tentativas de criar um bom
impacto no mundo ocidental.

Prabhupada: Todo mundo está fazendo (?). Mas temos rejeitado. Nossa desgraça é que
nossa propriedade, nós rejeitamos.

Mr. Rajda: Em vez de rejeitar, seria correto dizer que temos travado

Prabhupada: Isso significa que não têm qualquer importância. Mas agora, se você quer fazer
algo, então você manter esta instituição rigidamente, seguir os princípios da
Bhagavad-Gita. Não importa. Não exige muitos homens. candras Ekas
tamo hanti nd ca sahasrasah tara. Se houver uma lua no céu, que é
suficientes. Você não precisa de milhões de estrelas cintilantes. Então, vamos lá ser um
instituição, e é aberto a todos. Não há dúvida de "secular" e
Particular .... Deixe-os aprender esta arte. Que é procurado. Não é cega, mas se aplica
sua consideração e levá-la após o julgamento maduro. Não, o que é isso?
Tudo está lá. Não há nenhuma dificuldade. Por que você está negligenciando esta
negócios importantes da Índia? Você acha que está certo?

Mr. Rajda: Não se descuide. E como real é feito, é melhor não,
apenas para o mundo, a Índia também.

Prabhupada: Sim.

Mr. Rajda: Rejeitado ... O impedimento foi que todos os governantes, a maioria deles
desistiu de acreditar na religião.

Prabhupada: Por que você está trazendo a religião? É a ciência. Por que você está confundindo
de novo? É que a religião, a criança está crescendo para se tornar um jovem? É que
religião? É a ciência.

Mr. Rajda: Mas eles não olham a partir dessa perspectiva.

Prabhupada: Isso significa que malandros. Eles não aceitam "Dois mais dois igual a
quatro. "

Mr. Rajda: Sim, correto. Inteligente ...

Prabhupada: Se não tomarmos a matemática como ela é, e se interpretar "Duas
mais dois igual a três ", isto é canalhice." Dois mais dois igual a quatro ", que
está em toda parte.

Mr. Rajda: Muito bem. Tudo está certo. Agora só colocar algumas concreto
propostas, como é que nós queremos continuar neste ...

Prabhupada: A proposta está lá. Aqui já é feito. O mesmo princípio,
as quatro coisas, mana bhava homem namaskuru mam mad-bhakto mad-Yaji, mam
evaisyasi asamsayah [Bg. 18,65]. Estes quatro princípios, qual é a dificuldade?
Mas se você está determinado: "Não, não vamos seguir", então quem pode educá-lo?
Não há nenhuma perda. E se houver algum ganho, por que não levá-la? Temos que
educar para muitos jovens. Então eu acho que o movimento harijana ... Você pode trazer
que ... Que um cavalheiro, Dr. Parmar (?), Você conhece?

Mr. Rajda: Faramar Dr.?

Prabhupada: Sim?

Mr. Rajda: Faramar, eu tenho ... Yeah.

Prabhupada: Ele lamentou que "O governo tem gasto muito dinheiro e nós
já tentei, mas não poderíamos melhorar a nossa posição. "

Tamala Krsna: Este cavalheiro que Srila Prabhupada estava mencionando o nome
Parmar Professor. Ele escreveu um artigo.

Prabhupada: Professar ... Professor.

Mr. Rajda: Professor Parmar. Ah, ha, que é ...

Prabhupada: Ele é o mesmo homem?

Mr. Rajda: Não, isso é diferente.

Prabhupada: Então eles estão com vontade para depois melhorar. Todo mundo está com vontade.
Então, vamos lá ser um oficial-demi, um instituto de regular para ensinar as pessoas a
princípios do Bhagavad-Gita como ele é. Bas. Não distorcê-la. Não alterá-la. Como
ela é. Qual é a objeção?

Mr. Rajda: Eu não consigo encontrar nenhuma objeção.

Prabhupada: Bhagavad-Gita é aceito, e até agora eu entendo que, quando
Morarji ia ser preso, ele disse que "Deixe-me terminar a minha leitura de
Bhagavad-Gita. "Eu li no jornal.

Mr. Rajda: Sim, ele estava dizendo.

Prabhupada: Então ele ... Ele é um devoto do Bhagavad-Gita, e há muitos
os outros. Então, por que este ensino não deve ser dada ao mundo inteiro?

Mr. Rajda: Agora, senhor, ele se levanta diariamente às 03h30, faz primeiro de todos os seus
coisas religiosas, a leitura do Bhagavad-Gita, e tudo isso. E o que se passa para
duas, três horas. Então, aos sete anos, sai de seu quarto depois de tomar o seu
banho. Então ele conhece particular ...

Prabhupada: E esses meninos estrangeiros, eles começam sua, este Bhagavad-Gita
prática 3,30-9,30. Eles não têm outros negócios. Você vê. Você tem
estudados nossa, essa Giriraja. O dia inteiro ele está fazendo. Eles estão todos sobre este assunto. A partir de
manhã, 3.30, até que eles estão cansados, 9.30, simplesmente Bhagavad-Gita.

Mr. Rajda: Maravilhoso.

Prabhupada: "E temos tantos materiais. Se vamos discutir sobre esta linha,
tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2,13], leva-se dias para entender.

Mr. Rajda: Muito.

Prabhupada: Agora, se isso for verdade, tatha dehantara praptih e nd hanyate
hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2,20], o que estamos fazendo para isso? Esta é a Bhagavad-Gita.
Na jayate nd nd mriyate va kadacin hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2,20]. Assim, quando
meu corpo é destruído, estou indo ... [Pausa] ... de porta em porta, vendendo o
livros e envio de dinheiro. Estamos levando a nossa missão no caminho. Eu não sou
recebendo nenhuma ajuda nem do governo, do público. E o registro
está lá no Bank of America, o quanto câmbio estou trazendo. Mesmo
neste saúde frágil também, estou trabalhando quatro horas, pelo menos, à noite. E
eles também estão me ajudando. Portanto, esta é a nossa tentativa individual. Porque não vem aqui?
Se você é realmente muito grave estudante do Bhagavad-Gita, porque você não vem,
cooperar? E Harav abhaktasya Kuto Mahad-guna manorathenasati dhavato ... [SB
5.18.12]. Você não pode fazer simplesmente honesto público pela legislação. Isso não é
possível. Esqueça isso. Isso não é possível. Harav abhaktasya Kuto .... Yasyasti
bhaktir sarvaih akincana bhagavaty ... Se você, se torna um devoto do
Senhor, todas as boas qualidades estarão lá. E Harav abhaktasya Mahad Kuto ... Se
ele não é um devoto ... Agora, muitas coisas condenação, está em andamento, grande, grande
líderes. jornal de hoje que tenho visto. "Este homem, que o homem, é rejeitada, mesmo."
Por quê? Harav abhaktasya Kuto. Qual é a vantagem de se tornar um grande líder se
ele não é um devoto? (Hindi) Você é muito inteligente, jovem e, portanto, eu sou
tentando dar-lhe alguma idéia, e se você puder dar alguma forma a essas idéias ...
Ele já está lá. Não é nenhum segredo. Simplesmente temos de ser sérios, que este
instituição deve estar lá para educar toda a sociedade humana. Nunca mente, uma
um número muito pequeno. Não importa. Mas o ideal deve ser lá.

Mr. Rajda: Isso é direito, correto. Se é possível em todos os ...

Giriraja: Não, nenhuma dificuldade. Não, não, não. Nenhuma dificuldade.

Prabhupada: E nós estamos preparados para desafiar ou enfrentar o desafio de qualquer
cientista, filósofo qualquer, qualquer político, qualquer um. Ele não é dogmático.

Mr. Rajda: Não é dogmática em tudo.

Prabhupada: O mesmo: é ciência. E Krishna diz, começa tatha
dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2,13], jara yauvanam kaumaram. Então, quem pode dizer nada
contra esta afirmação? mam Avajananti mudhah [Bg. 9,11]. Mas, infelizmente, o nosso
as pessoas tem Krsna como ser humano comum, como ... Avajananti mudhah mam. Se
mudha permanecer, como podemos ser ...? Porque Krsna vem apenas como um ser humano
ensinar-nos, estamos tendo que Ele é um de nós. "Então eu também pode se tornar Krsna."
Isso está acontecendo. Para que tantos milhares de anos Krsna é adorado como
a Suprema Personalidade de Deus. Há milhares de templos na Índia para
adorar Krsna. Ele é o homem comum? Tantas grandes, grandes líderes vieram e se foram.
Que se importam com eles? Porque Krsna é adorado ainda? Estas são as perguntas.

Índia (1): É a mensagem universal.

Prabhupada: Agora universal. Sim, temos fotos recentes dos nossos diferentes
templos. Basta ver como estão a ser adorado. Esta é em países estrangeiros.
Eles têm sua própria religião. Por que eles deveriam adorar Krsna? (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: Sim, a começar todo se é realmente perfeito.

Prabhupada: (Hindi) Prasada? (Pausa) O que é a circulação do nosso presente

Tamala Krsna: da nossa revista?

Prabhupada: Sim.

Tamala Krsna: Um milhão de cópias por mês.

Mr. Rajda: Um milhão de cópias.

Tamala Krsna: Isso é apenas em Inglês. Em seguida, ele também é publicado em espanhol e
Português, alemão, francês, holandês, japonês, chinês, hindi, bengali ...

Prabhupada: guzerate.

Tamala Krsna: guzerate, Telegu. Recentemente, saiu com Húngaro
publicação. (Pausa)

Índia (1): Swamiji, sua idéia é ter alguma instituição internacional.

Prabhupada: Sim, este é internacional.

Índia (1): Não, temos feito para falar suas necessidades da humanidade ...

Prabhupada: Sim, eles estão seguindo. Eles estão seguindo. Quero torná-la mais
speedy, mas eu não tenho ajuda. Agora, por enquanto ... Agora, esses meninos são
me ajudar, eo governo é afastá-los: "Get out! Get out!" Você pode
Não me ajudar nisto?

Mr. Rajda: Correto. Na verdade ...

Prabhupada: Não índios estão chegando. Estou trazendo os homens e dinheiro de lá, e
Governo está a conduzir-lhes: "Saia!" Esta é a minha posição. E se um menino vai
volta e vem novamente - dez mil rúpias. Desta forma, eu estou perdendo de cinco a
seis lakhs de rúpias por ano - para nada. Esta é a cooperação do

Mr. Rajda: Mas por que o governo é expulsá-los?

Prabhupada: Isso, visto o seu chamado.

Tamala Krsna: Eles não vão nos dar o visto adequado para que possamos ficar.

Prabhupada: Assim como eu tenho na América residência permanente. Então, porque não
dar-lhes de residente permanente?

Mr. Rajda: Correto. Mas esse problema pode ser resolvido muito facilmente.

Prabhupada: Por favor, faça isso. Pelo menos ...

Mr. Rajda: Não, eu não sabia. Só agora vim a saber. Este ... Eu posso tocar
isso ...

Índia (1): É por isso que nós queremos algumas coisas concretas de você.

Mr. Rajda: É por isso que ...

Prabhupada: Isso vai ser uma grande ajuda imediatamente.

Mr. Rajda: Que eu vou fazer de imediato. Agora só ... É por isso que eu estava
inquirir que coisa concreta que você gostaria de fazer.

Prabhupada: Imediatamente gentilmente me ajudar, que dê pelo menos cem homens
permissão residencial permanente. Eles não são políticos. Eles não são
interessadas. Eles são devotos. Então eu posso gerenciar este estabelecimento, grande
como Bombaim, Vrndavana.

Mr. Rajda: Agora diga-me com os seus homens escrito sobre tudo isto (?). Vou dar-lhe

Prabhupada: Você tem que, feita em qualquer lista ...?

Tamala Krsna: Eu liguei para os nomes, para dentro de um curto período de tempo.

Prabhupada: Isso é tudo. Nome está lá. Então este é o ...

Índia (1): Primeira coisa progresso.

Mr. Rajda: Não, não, nós vamos fazer isso imediatamente, e mesmo se for necessário, eu vou
luta com o governo. Eles têm de fazê-lo. A única coisa é se você pode
me dar alguma nota, quais são os obstáculos ...

Prabhupada: Traga um pouco de papel. Escrevê-lo. Imediatamente começamos a fazer isso. Eles são
vindo de muito rico, respeitável família. Eles não vieram aqui para ganhar
dinheiro para explorar a Índia. Eles não têm nada para fazer isso. Posso garantir que
eles vão trazer o dinheiro da América e viver aqui - e não um toque único de paisa
Índia. Agora, suponha que existam cem americanos, e se eu estou trazendo dez
lakhs de rúpias por mês, então qual é o consumo per capita?

Mr. Rajda: per capita vai mostrar ...

Giriraja: Dez mil.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Índia (1): I. .. Yeah lista completa. É por isso que eu lhe perguntei: "O primeiro passo
você queria? "

Prabhupada: Por favor, ajuda.

Índia (1): passo concreto.

Prabhupada: Sim.

Índia (1): Que, o Sr. Ratensingh é obrigado a fazer.

Prabhupada: Por favor me ajude.

Mr. Rajda: Não, não, vamos pensar nos dever. Oh, eu sinto intensamente
sobre ele. Não há dúvida sobre isso.

Prabhupada: E eu garanto que, se tomar parte na política, você pode
afastar imediatamente. Eles não têm .... Eles deram tudo. Eles são
não pensar que eles são americanos. Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam paratvena-tat
nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19,170]. Este é o processo de bhakti.
Sarvopadhi vinirmuktam. Upadhi. Esta é Upadhi. Estou vivo, mas eu tenho
tem alguma designação, "Eu sou hindu", "eu sou muçulmano". Trata-se de designação. Assim
então eles são M.P. .. Esta é a designação. Você não está M.P. .. Você está vivendo
sendo, parte integrante de Deus.

Mr. Rajda: Correto.

Prabhupada: E esta designação pode ser movido, removido a qualquer momento. Indira
Gandhi, não mais minis prime ... Cargo acabado. Então vinirmuktam-sarvopadhi
Cc [. Madhya 19,170], quando uma pessoa se torna livre de toda designação, paratvena-tat
nirmalam, simplesmente consciência de Krishna, ele torna-se purificado. Hrsikena
bhakti sevanam hrsikesa ... Então começa bhakti.

prasannatma brahma-bhutah

nd nd socati kanksati

bhutesu sarvesu Samah

mad-bhaktim param labhate

Bg [. 18,54]

Esta é a condição preliminar. Então isso significa que logo se tornaram
devoto, eles não têm mais de designação. Essa concepção não existe: "Eu sou
Americano "," Eu sou índio "," Eu sou hindu "," eu sou muçulmano "- não.

Mr. Rajda: Direito. Muito bom.

Prabhupada: Concluído. Nirmala. Então ... Então você está dando a nota?

Tamala Krsna: O que você gostaria na nota?

Mr. Rajda: Só o problema que você ...

Prabhupada: Escrever. O que estou dizendo, escrever-lhe e dar-lhe. Este é o mais
ponto importante.

Mr. Rajda: Existem problemas locais ainda sobrevivem?

Prabhupada: O nosso problema local ... Agora, o que aconteceu com o município?

Tamala Krsna: Sim, é isso aí.

Prabhupada: Escrever. Por que você não escrever de imediato?

Mr. Rajda: Dá-me uma nota. Sempre que eu puder ajudar, vou fazê-lo definitivamente.
Há denúncia, se você ... Primeiro de tudo, sobre o visto, que é muito
difícil de ser removida, e agora ...

Prabhupada: Em um trabalho bonito que você nota.

Tamala Krsna: Sim, eu estou indo para digitá-lo para baixo, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Sim. Fazê-lo imediatamente. No Bhagavata diz-se que não tem
tem que aprender Bhagavata, mas se ele simplesmente diz: "Sim, é muito agradável", ele
se algum bom resultado. Da mesma forma, nosso movimento é tal que se apenas um
reconhece: "Sim, é bom ..." Seu ministro-chefe aceitou, Maharastra

Devoto (2): Sim, Chawan.

Prabhupada: Quando é que o corte que foi publicado? Ele veio, todos, em Punjab.
Portanto, não há dúvida sobre isso, que esta é a melhor atividades humanitárias.
Tão gentilmente nos ajudar na medida do possível.

Mr. Rajda: Não, acho que me dever. É muito importante.

Prabhupada: Thank you very much. (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: Eu falei com ele também. Ele está sempre comigo neste público
vida, desde o início.

Prabhupada: Você também M.P.?

Índia (1): Não, eu era vereador.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Mr. Rajda: Ele era um vereador aqui em Bombaim.

Prabhupada: Oh, o conselheiro municipal ... (Hindi) O que é isso?

Devoto (3): É o corte Chawan em jornal.

Prabhupada: Por que você não leu outra? Leia em voz alta.

Bhakti Caru: "Ministro-Chefe elogia movimento Krishna. Consciência de Krishna foi
a essência de toda fé e pertencia ao mundo, Maharastra ministro-chefe
Mr. MP Chawan disse na Terceira Internacional Hare Krishna no Festival
Cross Maidan em Bombaim na quarta-feira. Mr. Chawan elogiou o trabalho realizado pelo
Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, fundador-acharya da Sociedade Internacional
para a Consciência de Krishna. Ele disse que Swami foi responsável por popularizar
Consciência de Krishna em todo o mundo. Falando depois da ministra-chefe,
Swami Prabhupada enfatizou a necessidade de uma compreensão científica do
Bhagavad-Gita para resolver os problemas enfrentados pela humanidade. "Quando a sociedade humana
é sem dharma ", disse ele," a sociedade torna-se animal. " O festival,
programado para terminar na terça-feira, foi prorrogada mais cinco dias. "

Prabhupada: Então, sua esposa também ...

Mr. Rajda: Mas agora, coitado, ele também vai. Esse é o seu destino.

Prabhupada: Isso é tudo. Esta é a luta política. Não importa. Um homem é
que ele é. Isso é tudo. E para chegar a este campo de atividades, é preciso
tornar-se livre de todos os designação. "Eu sou o ministro-chefe" ou isto ou aquilo,
que é a designação. Então eu tenho que desistir.

Mr. Rajda: É uma coisa temporária.

Prabhupada: coisa temporária. Não devemos ter de se incomodar com esses temporários
as coisas. E isso serve para os governantes. Bhagavad-Gita, no capítulo quarto,

yogam vivasvate imã

avyayam aham proktavan

praha manave Vivasvan

bravit iksvakave manur '

Bg [. 4.1]

evam parampara praptam ... Bg [. 4,2].

Devotos: Imam viduh rajarsayo.

Prabhupada: Imam viduh rajarsayo. Ele é destinado para os governantes, rajarsi, não para
os vadios. Imam rajarsayo viduh. (Hindi) Nossa, essa monarquia estava lá, mas
foram rajarsis, monarca, ao mesmo tempo, grande pessoa santa. Portanto
eles eram adorados, Maharaja Yudhisthira, Maharaja Pariksit, Maharaja
Ambarisa. Eles não são autocrata. Imam rajarsayo viduh. Eles entenderam a
ciência do Bhagavad-Gita de pessoa santa, brahmanas exaltado. Eles governaram.
Você vai encontrar no Srimad-Bhagavatam este Pariksit Maharaja, neto de Arjuna.
Seu pai morreu quando ele ainda estava no ventre de sua mãe. Assim, todos, todos morreram.
Apenas estes cinco irmão permaneceu. E Pariksit Maharaja, o neto de
Arjuna, que estava no ventre de sua mãe Uttara. Assim, ele também foi tentado ser
morto por Asvatthama por Brahmastra. Krishna salvou. Então, de qualquer maneira, o
avós cuidavam da criança, do bebê no útero. E quando ele nasceu ...
Esta é uma cerimônia, jata-carma. Logo após o nascimento não é uma cerimônia. Isto é
ido agora, a DASA, dasa karana ... Ninguém é ... Então eles estão fazendo o horóscopo, o
brahmanas. "Então, essa criança vai ser assim, como este, assim, como este",
Yudhisthira Maharaja questão era a de que "O que você está falando, isso é tudo
direita. Se esta criança será a reputação de seus antepassados, como dar
felicidade aos idosos, Praja-Palana? "Ele estava ansioso," quanto ele será
qualificada, Praja Palana, como manter o prajas muito feliz? Primeiro de tudo ver
isso. "Este foi o teste, Praja-Palana. E afirma-se neste Bhagavatam ...
Agora descobrir esta decisão de Yudhisthira Maharaja, nesse capítulo, a primeira parte. Assim
não havia nem mesmo a doença durante o seu reinado. Adayo vyadhayah. (?) Não houve
extremas de calor, não houve frio extremo, em virtude da sua rajarsi. E a sua
negócio só foi para ver ... E Senhor Ramachandra. Como ele mantinha
temas como o pai. Portanto, as pessoas ainda estão com vontade depois rajya rama.
Existe um capítulo, "Regime Maharaja Yudhisthira de". Ver o conteúdo. (Pausa)

Devoto (2): Isto é, quando Yudhisthira Maharaja estava se aposentando, ou antes?

Prabhupada: Não, quando ele estava no poder.

Devoto (2): Regente, sim.

Prabhupada: O reino de Maharaja Yudhisthira, há capítulo.

Devoto (3): Devo ler?

Prabhupada: Sim.

Devoto (3): "Maharaja Yudhisthira, cujo inimigo que nunca nasceu, fez sua
diária direitos manhã rezando, oferecendo sacrifício de fogo para o deus-sol, e
oferecendo reverências, grãos, vacas, terra e ouro para os brahmanas. Ele, então,
entrou no palácio para pagar respeita aos idosos. No entanto, ele não poderia encontrar
seu tio ou tia, a filha do Rei Subala. "Devo ler o significado?

Prabhupada: Não. O que é o sloka?


Ajata-satruh hutagnir maitro pūrvāhņa-

vipran natva tila-go-rukmaih-bhumi ...

Prabhupada: Não, o sloka é, começo é sarva-dugha mahi, como aquele.
Parjanyah ... (Pausa) Ah. Kamam vavarsa parjanyah sarva-kama-dugha mahi [SB
1.10.4]. Descubra este versículo.

Giriraja: eu posso encontrá-lo.

Prabhupada: Sim.

Giriraja: Sobre a forma como a ... Há um ... Não, 1,2

Prabhupada: Este é o verso, kamam vavarsa parjanyah sarva-kama-dugha mahi
[SB 1.10.4]. (Hindi) conhecimento tão vasto.

Giriraja: Devo ler?

Prabhupada: Sim.

Giriraja: "Durante o reinado de Maharaja Yudhisthira as nuvens choveram de todos os
água que as pessoas precisavam ".

Prabhupada: Sim. Leia o verso original.

Giriraja: Oh, me desculpe.

parjanyah vavarsa kamam

sarva-kama-dugha mahi

gavah vrajan sisicuh sma

payasodhasvatir muda

[SB 1.10.4]

Prabhupada: Tradução?

Giriraja: "Durante o reinado de Maharaja Yudhisthira regado a nuvem todos os
água que as pessoas precisavam, ea terra produziu todas as necessidades do homem
profusão. Devido ao seu saco de leite gordo e atitudes alegres, a vaca utilizado para
umedecer a terra de pastagem com leite. "

Prabhupada: (Hindi) Agora leia o significado.

Lokanatha: "O princípio básico do desenvolvimento econômico é centrado na terra
e vacas. As necessidades da sociedade humana são grãos de comida ... "

Prabhupada: Sobre a terra e vacas, isto é Bhagavad-Gita, referiu,
krsi-go-raksya vanijyam-vaisya-karma svabhava jam [Bg. 18,44]. Nunca recomenda
fábrica. Krsi-go-raksya vanijyam [Bg. 18,44]. Portanto, não há questão de dar
proteção para as vacas se dá apenas leite. Não. Vá raksya. Não deve ser
proteção à vaca. Esta é a consciência de Krishna. Mesmo as vacas urinar
e fezes, que é benéfico. E se dá leite, então não há dúvida.
Hm. O que é isso?

Lokanatha: "As necessidades da sociedade humana são grãos, frutas, leite,
minerais, vestuário, madeira, etc Um exige que todos estes itens para satisfazer os
necessidades materiais do corpo. Certamente não se exigir carne e peixe ou
ferramentas de ferro e máquinas. Durante o regime de Maharaja Yudhisthira, todo
o mundo havia chuvas regulamentado. As chuvas não estão no controle da
o ser humano. O rei dos céus Indradeva é o controlador das chuvas, e ele
é o servo do Senhor. Quando o Senhor foi obedecida pelo rei e do povo
sob administração do rei, não são regulamentados chuvas a partir do horizonte,
e estas chuvas são as causas de todas as variedades de produção na terra. Não
chuvas só não regulamentado ajudar ampla produção de grãos e frutas, mas quando
Eles combinam com as influências astronômicas não há produção suficiente de valiosos
pedras e pérolas. Cereais e legumes podem sumptuosamente alimentar um homem e






Isso é tudo.



Esta é ...

O que é isso? Quanto




Isso é tudo.

que ...



O que é isso?

os homens.

E eu sou
Então ...

Isso é tudo.

é necessária.
É isso aí.



Isto é


Todos nós.


instrução. Amara

Isso é tudo. Você

Não em todos.
da vida.

da história.
Onde estão


O que é

Hm? Em todos os lugares. Que






Você é ...

Ele foi

Isso é




o dinheiro.

Quais são as


Isso é tudo.


os outros.


Eu estava lendo

Mas isso é

Isso é tudo. Isso é

Very nice.


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